Content-length: 31097 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 #21 John Macnish at the British UFO Research Association


John Macnish at the British UFO Research Association, 4th December 1993


What do you get if you add together a sore throat, a baby continually crying and some nutter accusing you of being a government agent ? A BUFORA lecture of course ! Poor old John Macnish, this was every public speaker's worst nightmare come true - the curse of the crop circles eyeing up their next victim !! Fortuitously John Macnish's contribution to the crop circle debate was saved by some old fashioned common sense and the showing of two previously unseen crop circle videos which will form the basis of Cropcircle Communique II, which is to be released this Spring (See address.).

John Macnish began by introducing the title of his lecture - "Crop Circles, the Final Chapter", which he admitted was a "relief at the end of an interminable obsession" with the subject. He explained that he hoped his lecture would "lift the lid and blow a few misconceptions".

His first video concentrated on the mystery of the circles, drawing attention to the evolution of patterns and the variety of explanations that had been proffered. This first video featured the famous Day Time Live "trilling" incident at Beckhampton, the Blackbird fiasco (including the BBC Breakfast Time interview with Colin Andrews), the confrontation between George Wingfield and Terence Meaden at Barbury Castle, and Doug and Dave's claim to have invented the phenomenon in "1978". John Macnish confessed that during 1992 he had kept "a very close eye on" Doug Bower and Dave Chorley and that this had led to "a year of revelation" for himself. A few factual errors crept into this first video, eg Macnish claimed that circles "always appear at night" and that "no hard facts had emerged" during the 1980s which pointed towards a solution. Both of these are highly contentious statements.

At the end of this first video John Macnish discussed the Doug and Dave claim. He began by stating that at the Chilgrove demonstration both men claimed to have made no more than 30 formations a year (sometimes less). According to the records of the Circles Phenomenon Research Group there had been at least 75 "confirmed crop circles" for 1987. This contrasted sharply with the "26" circles recorded by CERES. Macnish believed that this discrepancy was because CERES counted a circle as just one formation whereas CPR counted each separate component. Macnish concluded that whilst there was no reason to suspect deliberate misrepresentation the use of CPR's inflated figures by the media had helped to discredit Doug and Daves' claim.

Next John Macnish admitted that Doug and Dave had no "hard evidence" which proved their claim. He concluded that most cerealogists had dismissed their claim because they had taken no photographs of themselves half-way through making circles. According to Macnish this widespread dismissal of Doug and Dave contrasted sharply with the reactions of the two men who had examined their story most closely. He believed that both Meaden and Delgado had listened to Doug and Daves' claim and carefully examined their maps and diagrams. Following this both Meaden and Delgado had "dramatically changed their viewpoints" after reviewing this evidence. Meaden now dismissed all but the simplest of circles as hoaxes whilst Delgado (in 1992) had "washed his hands" of the subject. This, in Macnish's view, demonstrated that "the hard facts surrounding this subject are not always what they seem". He concluded that "sometimes, the hard facts amount to a downright con".

In his second film Macnish began by examining the results of The Cerealogist's circle-making competition at West Wycombe. During the commentary Macnish stated that:

"I was well impressed with the formations, by the lay of the crop and by the precision of the shapes that these teams had created."

Strangely, the "team of experts" that were called in to examine these man-made hoaxes were "not nearly so impressed" with what they found. Macnish felt that the fact that these "experts" already knew that the circles they were examining were hoaxes influenced their conclusions. His video went on to show how Adrian Dexter's team easily constructed an outer ring.

Next the video showed Rupert Sheldrake, one of the two men who thought up the idea for a circle-making competition. Sheldrake made an astonishingly frank statement about the man-made circles:

"They were much better than I expected. Firstly, the performance at night was much more silent and much less obvious. ... I think the standard of these formations was extremely high. The subtlety of the way things were laid, the subtlety of the way the stalks were bent and that kind of thing, may well differ from the ones observed which may be genuine in the fields, but the overall impression is very very good, they've done fantastically well."

John Macnish then presented night-time film of Doug and Dave making crop circles during 1992. This was achieved by using a night-time image intensifier with a range of about half a mile as well as still photography. The video film showed Doug and Dave using their circle-making equipment at night. Macnish concluded that because of the quality of the circles they produced. "After a very short time I had absolutely no doubts in my mind that everything they claimed they could have actually achieved".

Macnish went on to state that during 1992 Doug and Dave made more circles than they had ever claimed in a single year:

"Their enthusiasm and co-operation persuaded me that they were telling the truth. They've nothing to hide. They've nothing to conceal. And I watched them as a natural history photographer would observe wildlife from a distance".

Macnish's video showed Doug and Dave making several huge formations as well as "grapeshot" circles. Macnish claimed that throughout the 1992 season Doug and Dave sent him diagrams and water-colour paintings of formations that later appeared in fields.

John Macnish noted that many of the dimensions of circles published in the crop circle literature were consistent with the dimensions of the formations Doug and Dave made during the 1992 season.

One fascinating revelation was that during the summer of 1993 John Macnish had accidentally caught on film a group of three hoaxers making a pictogram on Waden Hill near Avebury. This hoax was constructed in pouring rain and fog, under freezing temperatures. For an independent eye witness account of crop circle hoaxing at nearby Silbury Hill see the box on page 16.

John Macnish commented on Jim Schnabel's circle-making. He remarked how strange it was that none of the crop circle "believers" accepted Schnabel's claim to have made the so-called Dharmic Wheel formations. Macnish's video showed time-lapse photographs of Schnabel making such a formation. Macnish showed a second film of hoaxers he had accidentally captured on film.

Colin Andrews then appeared, talking about his doubt about the Ickleton Mandelbrot formation. Apparently small "pivots" which had been found placed around the edge of the formation. Andrews also felt that the positioning of the formation was suspicious. Despite these reservations he admitted that the Mandelbrot was "extremely impressive". Andrews also admitted that during an interview for the National Geographic documentary he had found a peg with a white painted top in the East Kennett pictogram. He concluded that because of the positioning of this peg this formation was a man-made hoax.

John Macnish's lecture went on to examine some of Doug and Daves' circle-making techniques in detail. He showed how the hoaxers used the cap-mounted sighting-device which had bought them so much ridicule. He also showed how they made grapeshot circles and complex layering effects inside complex S-shaped swirls. In this latter case Macnish claimed that the C.C.C.S. had promoted Doug and Daves' hoax as "genuine".

Macnish then addressed the alleged similarity between crop circle formations and prehistoric art forms. He suggested that entoptic forms - random images produced by the subconscious mind - might be influencing the patterns being created by hoaxers. Since all humans draw on the same archetypes it was not surprising that crop circles appealed to such a wide cross-section of people.

Question Time

After the break John Macnish fielded numerous questions from his somewhat sceptical audience. In response to a question from Stanley Morcom he began by explaining why Doug and Dave had chosen not to enter The Cerealogist's circle-making competition in 1992. This was due to three reasons - a fear that by revealing their circle-making techniques they would compromise their claim in the eyes of their detractors, a fear that farmers would take "retribution" were Doug and Dave to be seen making circles in public too often, and a fear that due to Montague Keen's former links with the National Farmers Union legal department they "might end up in jail without the three thousand pounds". Asked to elaborate Macnish explained that Doug and Dave have never set out to prove their claim, they had made circles because they wanted to experience the thrill of fooling people who had "set themselves up to be experts".

The second question concerned the extent of the historical evidence. Macnish began by stating that Colin Andrews and Pat Delgado had done a "massive amount of research" into the historical evidence. This reviewer would strongly question this claim, because despite this "massive" research Andrews & Delgado didn't know about the Westbury circles of 1980. Apparently the earliest photograph Andrews and Delgado had discovered was taken by farmer Ian Stevens in 1978 [shown on page 16 of Circular Evidence], who reported seeing circles "a year or so" before that on his land. According to Macnish this photograph is the earliest known photograph of a sharply-defined circle displaying "an intelligent looking floor design" from an "English" field. Expanding on this crucial theme John Macnish reviewed Paul Fuller's collection of historical evidence. Macnish admitted there was a "vast amount of data" including anecdotes, sketches and the Mowing Devil case. He admitted that this suggested that it was likely that "some kind of phenomenon existed before [1978]". However, Macnish went on to state that "nobody, to my knowledge, has got a single photograph of the so-called crop circle phenomenon before 1978." He backed up this statement by referring to Michael Green of the CCCS. Green was an archaeologist who had conducted a search through Cambridge University's Archeology Aerial Photography Society's archive, which contained photographs dating back to the 1920 and 1930s. Apparently Green had failed to find a single photograph of a crop circle. His questioner attempted to refute this argument by insisting that Macnish extend his studies beyond England to include overseas cases.

The third questioner asked Macnish about the video tapes he had made during Operation Blackbird. Macnish stated that his team had five video cameras operating on the night the Blackbird hoax was perpetrated. One camera was positioned in such a way as to record half land and half sky, in case an unidentified phenomenon created a circle. Apparently this unpublished video sequence showed nothing but sky all night. The third questioner then asked about the timing of events, as Pat Delgado had later claimed that several people had witnessed flashing triangular lights in the sky. Macnish stated that this eye witness account was reported to him by Delgado at 8.15 am that morning, before he had even examined the video tape. At this point the discussion became somewhat acerbic. Jayne Macnish refuted a suggestion that they and the BBC were "covering up" evidence. She offered to take the name and address of the questioner and send him a copy of the relevant video tape for him to view. This reviewer has seen proof that this promise was kept.

Another member of the audience asked Macnish why no one on Bratton Down had seen the crosses that were found in the Blackbird hoax circles despite the extensive use of binoculars. Macnish explained that the crosses were only 2-3 feet across, were a long way from the hillside and that there had been a great deal of excitement at the time. He also described how members of the Operation Blackbird team had immediately guarded the formation once it was seen so that no one could tamper with it. This was to ensure that Colin Andrews and Pat Delgado could examine the circle and pass judgement on it. He surprised his questioner by stating that he had film of the hoaxers making the Blackbird circles and that this had been enhanced by the BBC at Basingstoke and then shown on the BBC 6 o' clock news that same evening.

The fourth question concerned the bending of plants at their nodes. John Macnish admitted that he had never managed to film the "magical" bending of the crop claimed by the researchers because the bend was always at ground level. Indeed he had only seen this effect once, in a circle at Baltic Farm. Pressed to explain how some circles were only a few inches below the height of surrounding crop Macnish described how the geotrophic response mechanism always defined the shape of the stem. He also drew on the work by Project Argus, which apparently found that the peculiar bending of stems inside crop circles was entirely natural.

The fifth questioner began by claiming that Michael Hesseman had "numerous" photos of crop circles predating 1978 which Macnish should have known about because they were passed around at Doug Bower's July 1993 Marlborough meeting on July 28th 1993 [actually it was me, PF]. He also claimed that despite Macnish's earlier comments Pat Delgado was still conducting research into crop circles. Macnish pointed out that his claim that Delgado had "dropped out" of circles research related to 1992 not 1993 and that this statement was supported by Delgado's suspension of his Newsletter that same year.

The fifth questioner then returned to his earlier point (3rd question) and implied that by refusing to release video shots of hoaxers making circles Macnish was covering up evidence. Not surprisingly John Macnish took exception to this. He and Jayne Macnish again offered to give any assistance required to the questioner to satisfy his point. The member of the audience claimed that it was possible to simulate hoaxers making circles on film and that he could do so in "ten minutes". John Macnish countered by pointing out that it would cost £ 15-20,000 to produce such a simulation. John Macnish went on to question why he and other sceptical researchers were being accused of being involved in a conspiracy to discredit the subject...

"All I want to know is WHY do we want to discredit it ? What's in it for us ? I really don't understand."

The next question related to the Steven Alexander film. Macnish admitted that the film was a complete mystery and that he had no explanation for it. He went on to state that whatever the film showed there was no proof of a causal relationship between the "UFO" and the giant pictogram that was in an adjacent field.

Montague Keen asked the seventh question. He wanted to know how it was possible to create "weaving", where bunches of stems overlap in different directions up to five times. Keen drew attention to Ralph Noyes' photograph of this effect in the 1992 Dharmic Wheel, which Jim Schnabel claims to have made. He asked how can hoaxers create this effect ? Macnish responded by stating that he had seen Schnabel recreate this exact effect in circles he had created under test conditions. Keen responded by pointing out that as far as he could recall Schnabel had failed to recreate this effect when producing his demonstration circle on Keen's farm. Macnish accepted this but pointed out that he didn't think Schnabel had meant to exactly replicate the effects found in his Silbury Hill dharmic wheel at Keen's farm. He then explained how hoaxers deliberately set out to create effects which they knew crop circle experts claimed were mysterious in their books and articles. He also believed that some effects were accidental by-products of circle-making. "I think [researchers] often credit circle-makers with far more precision and planning than they actually put into [making] circles." This led to a discussion of the rules and factors surrounding the West Wycombe circle-making competition, the varying standards of circles produced under test conditions and how well these test conditions approximated to reality.

John Macnish's evasive response to the eighth question confounded his audience. He was asked to comment on the "correlations" found in John Martineau's analysis of the CCCS database. [Regular readers will recall that in various articles John Martineau has been accused of being a crop circle hoaxer]. Macnish responded "I think John has got probably a better insight than most researchers into the proportions ... and scientific proportions of crop circles. I don't want to go into the explanation in too great a detail but ... its one thing to study the circles, but ... its often, it can often be one jump ahead if you understand the planning behind them better than perhaps ... less privileged, people in a less privileged position than yourself". Not surprisingly someone asked John to clarify his answer. Curiously Macnish avoided explaining precisely what he had meant and instead went on to discuss Professor Gerald Hawkins' discovery of "diatonic" ratios in circles which Macnish knew Doug and Dave had claimed to have made, a finding he believed he could explain with reference to the length of their circle making equipment.

The next questioner expressed his opinion that Macnish's video told him nothing that was not already known and that it had always been known that people could make crop circles. He then asked Macnish to explain the Alexander film of a mini UFO floating above the crop. Macnish explained (again) that just because an unusual object was filmed above a crop circle this did not prove a causal relationship. He then revealed that Canadian researcher Chad Deetken had recently claimed that a circle exhibited "deformed seedheads, crop cut with razor-like precision, which couldn't possibly be made by human beings". According to Macnish these samples had been taken from the circle he had filmed being made by Doug and Dave that had been shown in his first video. This led to a prolonged discussion about unusual effects inside crop circles. Macnish described how the BBC TV Daytime Live programme was plagued by problems whenever they did crop circle items. He concluded that these effects were given special attention because of the mystique surrounding crop circles. According to Macnish normally such problems attract far less attention.

Lucy Pringle then asked a question about animal reactions. Macnish confessed that there were many things connected with crop circles that he could not explain. However, he recalled that during a Daytime Live interview in 1990 a dog was bought into a circle which went berserk. Later his own dog was physically sick when bought into a circle in Shropshire. According to a local vet his dog had eaten barley husks which have long barbed husks that caused this reaction. Lucy Pringle went on to describe a second hand account of a dog entering a circle and then almost immediately going to sleep at the centre. John Macnish admitted that he couldn't explain this behaviour but he still maintained that the link between the claimed effect and the circle was "tenuous", as was the reaction of the TV crew during the famous Daytime Live trilling sound incident. According to Macnish the TV crew reacted in the way they did because they were influenced "by where they are". He concluded this discussion by stating that alleged animal reactions inside crop circles were often inconsistent and, in some cases, there were no reactions.

The next questioner asked Macnish's opinion about a meteorological explanation for the crop circles. Macnish felt that this was valuable work. However, he believed that when Meaden first met Doug Bower Doug had claimed all the "first" circles known to Meaden during the early years. This problem was compounded because during the early years relatively few circles were being reported. Macnish argued that since Doug and Dave could account for "all" of these circles (including the "first" circles at Westbury in 1980) Meaden's meteorological explanation was severely compromised. Of course this argument avoids the issue of contemporary eye witness testimony made during the early 1980s.

John Macnish's sceptical response prompted Ralph Noyes to ask Macnish his opinion about the historical evidence. Ralph Noyes described some of the historical cases and their relationship to modern events, referring to cases that feature in Ted Phillips' Physical Trace Catalogue

as well as to the Tully circles that had given Doug Bower the idea of making crop circles. Ralph Noyes stated that he had a slide of a crop field in Minnesota in 1974 which displayed numerous circular markings [just like the 1989 Kings Bromley case described by TORRO's David Reynolds in Circles From The Sky, pages 73-83]. He went on to question the value of Doug and Daves' decision to alter the date of their "first" circles from 1978 to 1976 and then again to 1975 following Ken Brown's research into their claim.

In response John Macnish accepted that he was unsatisfied with the continual revising of the "1978" date claimed by Doug and Dave. In his opinion 1978 was the most probable date of their "first" circles because this was the date they had quoted at the media demonstration at Chilgrove as well as the date they gave to the TODAY newspaper. He justified his decision by saying that both men must have repeatedly discussed this topic with eachother prior to the TODAY exclusive. With regards to the historical evidence John Macnish accepted that there was an extensive collection of unexplained ground markings (UGMs) from all over the world which Doug and Dave had not made and which, to date, had not been adequately explained. He pointed out however that the photograph on the front cover of The Crop Circle Enigma showed a crop circle NOT a UGM, so [by implication] it was clear that the CCCS had been studying crop circles rather than UGMs. Ralph Noyes challenged this point because there had been confusion over whether or not Doug and Dave had really made the so-called Swastika formations of 1989. Macnish responded that he believed that the issue of the two "Swastika" formations had been confused because only one of these two formations was really a Swastika and, in his opinion, Doug and Daves' memories were not as clear as they believed.

In response to a question from BUFORA's John Spencer Macnish accepted that many of Doug and Daves' earlier circles were placed in obscure places simply because Doug and Dave were more concerned about getting caught than thinking about where best to locate their circles to attract publicity. Ralph Noyes returned to the subject of the Swastika formations, claiming that he had personally searched for one of the Swastikas and found it very difficult to find. Macnish responded to this point by stating that he had been given numerous drawings and paintings of formations that Doug Bower had drawn and then constructed which the CCCS had never discovered because they were made in such obscure locations and were harvested before the CCCS or anyone else had found them. At this Macnish was again pressed by the member of his audience who had accused him of covering up evidence. It was stated that there was no reason why Doug Bower could not have made these drawings after seeing real formations.

The next questioner asked for technical details about the night-time film shown during the videos. He then asked Macnish whether he believed that "every crop circle reported around the world" was a hoax, pointing out that "several thousand" such cases had been reported. Macnish began by immediately questioning the "several thousand" cases quoted, as he believed that this figure was "grossly exaggerated". He then stated that "[All] crop circles, as we would define them, - sharply-defined edges, - symmetrical floor patterns, - any formation showing the slightest hallmark of intelligent design - is man-made". Heckled once again Macnish admitted that he could not prove this opinion but that he thought it was wholly supported by the evidence. Another member of the audience then implied that Macnish had not presented a balanced viewpoint in his videos. Not surprisingly Macnish took exception to this suggestion. He pointed out that in all his videos he had gone to great lengths to ensure that what appeared on film was balanced and well-researched. He admitted that since producing Crop Circle Communique he had altered his opinion about the subject by "180 degrees".

Again Macnish was asked about a meteorological explanation. He responded by referring to Meaden's attempts to verify the plasma vortex via laboratory experiments and stated that in his opinion this was valuable work that needed doing. One member of the audience suggested that the postulated atmospheric solution to crop circles may have been responsible for the 1980 Tunguska event. Macnish doubted this but pointed out that whilst Meaden had produced a valuable theory it was no more than a theory and that there was no "hard evidence" to support the theory.

Another member of the audience asked John Macnish about Jim Schnabel's claim to have made numerous crop circles. John Macnish admitted that he had witnessed Jim Schnabel making numerous crop circles during 1993. He also admitted that he was baffled by Schnabel's "obsession" in driving "the length and breadth of Britain" to make circles.

Finally Lucy Pringle again asked John Macnish to account for some of the unusual effects associated with circles. Macnish accepted that he could not explain the Daytime Live trilling sound but that sound recording experts he had spoken to had suggested it was some kind of natural or man-made interference on the radio microphones. At the end the audience warmly applauded John and Jayne Macnish for their lecture.


Crop Circle Communique 2

Readers will be pleased to learn that the contents of the two videos shown during this lecture will form the basis of Crop Circle Communique 2, which will be released shortly.

If you want a cassette tape of this lecture contact Robin Lindsey at 87, Station Road, Whittlesey, Peterborough, PE7 1UE (telephone 0733 203414).


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